> I got flamed good and proper by some outraged VW owners because of
> remarks
> I made about poor quality on VWs, Audis and Saabs and the resulting
> low
> resale values these cars have. To back up my assertion :
> My opinion about VWs, Audis and Saabs is formed not only by personal
> experience, but is backed up by how the market votes on the resale
> value of
> these cars. Here’s the fack, Jack:
Since when does quoting market votes back up your assertion that VWs, Audis,
and Saabs have low resale values because of low quality? There are many
reasons why these cars have lower resale value than their Japanese counterpart.
And since when did Audi, Saab, and even VW have less quality in the parts they
use, as compared to the Japanese? When you talk quality, are you talking
reliability based on J.D. Bothers? If you want to talk quality of many
components, nothing, not Mopar, GM Parts, Honda Parts…etc, comes close to
the quality of German parts. Saabs and Volvos are Swedish cars, but benefit
from many German parts. For eg. when a person wants to upgrade the shocks on
his car, the famous products, would be Bilstein and Boge. Their equipment is
already stock on most european cars. Seats? Higher end VWs use Recaro.
Wheels? VW has bought over BBS. Rotors are made by Brembo, an Italian
company. My point is this: European companies mostly build the body and
engine, but they rely on aftermarket European suppliers for their other parts.
Since many of these European companies are at the top of their field, there is
no comparison with quality. The Japanese tend to spend money on what the
consumer can see, and feel, like the interior gauges and switches. Under the
skin, however is a different story. How many Japanese cars do you know, that
uses horse hair to pad their seats?
Resale value? Price is based on demand. How many Golfs are sold in comparison
to Civics? Many consumers can’t see the Golf as being a better car than the
Civic. They aren’t enthusiasts, and prefer the more refined ride in the civic.
They see convienience in having a Honda dealer at every corner.
Resalve values? Despite resale values, I would always buy a European car over
a Japanese car. Right now I have a VW Passat, and it is the most awesome
family sedan I have ever owned. I drive it a lot harder than a friend who has
a 1993 Accord SE Coupe, yet he has problems that the average car owner will
never understand. His door stick whenevever they are opened or closed, and
have had to be re-aligned 3 times since he bought it 6 months ago (24,000 kms
on the car). This is an indicator of poor structural integrity, a major
engineering flaw. No such problems on my VW, as it drives as if it has been
carved from a rock.
You can’t argue with facts though, European cars, do have a lower resale value
than the Japanese, but this is not because of lesser quality. Regardless of
resale value, I would still buy the euro marque.
Sorry, Charlie – the resale is a direct reflection on the quality of the car.
I have never said that the Europeans can’t build good cars. What I have said
is that VW, Audi and Saab can’t seem to get it together anymore – or, more
correctly, they can’t get ‘em to stay together! I don’t deny that many of the
European components are excellent. My experience with these cars is more than
from just being in the car business – it also comes from having owned two Audis
and seven VWs. The last GOOD, as in reliable, VW I had was my ’72 Squareback.
I have owned two VWs since and they were both awful. Perhaps the problem here
is semantics. To my mind Quality is related to Reliability. And my experience
with these cars, both as an owner, and as a manager in a car dealership is
consistently negative. I am NOT a Europhobe. This trio of cars consistently
shows me that they may be well thought out, but poorly executed in terms of
reliability of components. I am not just talking about things like the power
train, I am talking about the little daily irritations – pieces of the dash
falling off, window winders not staying on, seat back releases that don’t
release, ad nauseum. Every VW I have taken in trade in the last five years
has needed its entire ‘Fahrvegnator’ replaced! I have always taken excellent
care of my vehicles – weekly washing, oil changes and tire rotation every
3,000 miles, maintanence done by the book at the dealer, etc. I switched off
from VW when my ’85 Jetta needed a valve job at 25,000 miles! Last week, I
took a ’93 Golf in trade at the dealership I work in – the A/C didn’t work,
the sunroof wouldn’t close and there was a short in the dash that kept the
instrument lights from coming on. I see this stuff all the time. Don’t mis-
understand me. I don’t wish VW, Audi or Saab any ill, but I believe hell
will freeze over before I will ever buy another one! Good luck with yours!
Paul Cruce
In <ZG7TBDo.pcr…@delphi.com>, Paul Cruce <pcr…@delphi.com> writes:
>release, ad nauseum. Every VW I have taken in trade in the last five years
>has needed its entire ‘Fahrvegnator’ replaced! I have always taken excellent
———— a WHAT?
>understand me. I don’t wish VW, Audi or Saab any ill, but I believe hell
>will freeze over before I will ever buy another one! Good luck with yours!
This comment shows some bias….
Marcus Bonse email: m.h.w.bo…@wbmt.tudelft.nl
Delft University of Technology
Lab. for Micro Engineering
In article <ZG7TBDo.pcr…@delphi.com>, Paul Cruce <pcr…@delphi.com> writes:
|> understand me. I don’t wish VW, Audi or Saab any ill, but I believe hell
|> will freeze over before I will ever buy another one! Good luck with yours!
|>
|> Paul Cruce
So what do you think about BMWs and Mercedes. The British magazine ‘Car’ did
a long term test of the Series III Golf. On their front cover they put a photo
of a lemon with a VW badge attached. They basically said the car was a piece of
crap. This surprised me as VW has always had a good reputation in Europe. The
Euro VWs are made in Germany, not Mexico or the U.S.
–
Andrew D.Grant
gr…@KMERL.Panasonic.COM
Marcus Bonse <m.h.w.bo…@wbmt.tudelft.nl> writes:
>>has needed its entire ‘Fahrvegnator’ replaced! I have always taken excellent
You know – its ‘Fahrvegnator’! That is what is supposed to give it its
Fahrvegnugen or how ever the hell you spell it.
>This comment shows some bias….
Of course – I’ve been burned too badly by these cars, both as an owner and a
dealer – but I sure don’t wish anyone else bad luck with them just because I’ve
not had good experiences with them!
Paul