This may have implications for elections also since many citizens are
demanding that the makers of electronic voting machines disclose their
source code too.
http://www.freedom-to-tinker.com/?p=914
Friday October 21, 2005 by Edward W. Felten
Lawyers for 150 Floridians accused of drunk driving have asked a court
to order the disclosure of the source code for software running in the
breathalyzer machines used by police to analyze their blood alcohol
level, according to a Tom Sanders story on vunet.
The defendants say they have the right to examine the machines that
accused them, and that a meaningful examination requires access to the
machines’ software. Prosecutors say the code is a trade secret.
The accused are right that one needs the code to understand fully how
the machines work. The machines consist of sensors, a user interface,
and control software. The software is the “brain” of the machine, and
it is almost certainly involved in the calculations that derive a
blood alcohol value from the sensor readings, as well as the display
of the calculated value. If the accused have the right to fully
examine the machines — and the article says that they do under Florida
law — then they should see the source code.
Contrary to the article and some other commentators, this is not a
dispute over whether the software should be open source. The accused
aren’t seeking to open the software to everybody; they only want it
opened to their legal teams.
There are standard practices for handling trade-secret information
that must be turned over in court cases. A court will typically
establish a protective order, which is a kind of nondisclosure
agreement covering secret material that is turned over by one side to
the other. The protective order will require parties to keep the
information secret and to use it only for purposes related to the
court proceedings. Typically the information can be turned over to a
limited number of expert analysts who have also signed the protective
order. Documents containing secret information are filed under seal,
and testimony about secret matters may take place in a closed
courtroom.
So this issue is not about open source, but about ensuring fairness
for the accused. If they’re going to be accused based on what some
machine says, then they ought to be allowed to challenge the accuracy
of the machine. And they can’t do that unless they’re allowed to know
how the machine works.
You might argue that the machine’s technical manuals convey enough
information. Having read many manuals and examine the innards of many
software systems, I’m skeptical of such claims. Often, knowing how the
maker says a machine works is a poor substitute for knowing how it
actually works. If a machine is flawed, it’s likely the maker will
either (a) not know about the flaw or (b) be unwilling to admit it
exists.
If the article’s description of Florida law is correct, this seems
like a pretty easy decision for the court.
On Mon, 24 Oct 2005 07:02:38 GMT, laura bush – VEHICULAR HOMICIDE
<xeton2…@yahoo.com> wrote:
>This may have implications for elections also since many citizens are
>demanding that the makers of electronic voting machines disclose their
>source code too.
Yes, it should – and both should be open to examination.
>If the article’s description of Florida law is correct, this seems
>like a pretty easy decision for the court.
yes – I’m surprised you bring this up – ANY bug in the software could
be grounds for dismissal of lots of DUI cases.
Innocent until proven guilty you know – ain’t that a bitch?
HAHAHAHAHAHA
What is unbelievable, Ted Kennedy did not serve a
single day in a jail cell, for Vehicular Homicide.
It is all about affluence and mighty bucks.
What is absolutely Amazing! He continues to
serve as a U.S. Senator.
He is a low-Life Drunk with bucks in his pocket.
"Ben" <nonspecif…@null.null> wrote in message
news:f93pl1tvp7r75bv7p1m5agk0faudtn07f2@4ax.com…
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
> On Mon, 24 Oct 2005 07:02:38 GMT- Tedddy Kennedy – VEHICULAR HOMICIDE
> <xeton2…@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>This may have implications for elections also since many citizens are
>>demanding that the makers of electronic voting machines disclose their
>>source code too.
> Yes, it should – and both should be open to examination.
>>If the article’s description of Florida law is correct, this seems
>>like a pretty easy decision for the court.
> yes – I’m surprised you bring this up – ANY bug in the software could
> be grounds for dismissal of lots of DUI cases.
> Innocent until proven guilty you know – ain’t that a bitch?
> HAHAHAHAHAHA
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Polish Prince (Szynka) wrote:
> What is unbelievable, Ted Kennedy did not serve a
> single day in a jail cell, for Vehicular Homicide.
> It is all about affluence and mighty bucks.
Well – the case against him was pretty weak. In contrast to that
against laura bush where even the police report said the fatal crash
was her fault.
"Polish Prince \(Szynka\)" <wawrzek…@worldnet.att.net> wrote in
news:CQ17f.173166$qY1.40265@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net:
> What is unbelievable, Ted Kennedy did not serve a
> single day in a jail cell, for Vehicular Homicide.
> It is all about affluence and mighty bucks.
What’s even more unbelievable is that states like Florida still use a
breathalyzer as the only means to detect OWIs. Wisconsin the accused is
actually given a full blood test to see if they have a high BAL.
–
"It’s interesting. I see all these political ads and all these
commentators say it’s our job as Americans to vote. Let me tell
you something, with Bush in charge of the economy, this might
be the only job you have all year." -Jay Leno
Polish Prince (Szynka) wrote:
> What is unbelievable, Ted Kennedy did not serve a
> single day in a jail cell, for Vehicular Homicide.
> It is all about affluence and mighty bucks.
> What is absolutely Amazing! He continues to
> serve as a U.S. Senator.
> He is a low-Life Drunk with bucks in his pocket.
Well he has good company. Murdering first lady Laura Bush never served
time either.
> > What is unbelievable, Ted Kennedy did not serve a
> > single day in a jail cell, for Vehicular Homicide.
> > It is all about affluence and mighty bucks.
> Well – the case against him was pretty weak.
You’re just another lying dem criminal coddler in love with another
drunk. How many people have you and your buddy Teddy killed and
maimed? At least 1!!!
In article <1130181136.215114.135…@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>,
"Larry Bud" <larrybud2…@yahoo.com> wrote:
> You’re just another lying dem criminal coddler in love with another
> drunk. How many people have you and your buddy Teddy killed and
> maimed? At least 1!!!
You must be a bush coddeling lying rightwing nutjob. How many people
has your buddy laura bush killed & maimed? At least 1 !!!! And she
still walks free!
mark wrote:
> In article <1130181136.215114.135…@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>,
> "Larry Bud" <larrybud2…@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > You’re just another lying dem criminal coddler in love with another
> > drunk. How many people have you and your buddy Teddy killed and
> > maimed? At least 1!!!
> You must be a bush coddeling lying rightwing nutjob. How many people
> has your buddy laura bush killed & maimed? At least 1 !!!! And she
> still walks free!
It’s not like she used Senatorial priviledge to bury a DUI case.
"mark" <markjs1@*nospam*yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:markjs1-34DFBC.13391524102005@newsclstr02.news.prodigy.com…
> In article <1130181136.215114.135…@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>,
> "Larry Bud" <larrybud2…@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> You’re just another lying dem criminal coddler in love with another
>> drunk. How many people have you and your buddy Teddy killed and
>> maimed? At least 1!!!
> You must be a bush coddeling lying rightwing nutjob. How many people
> has your buddy laura bush killed & maimed? At least 1 !!!! And she
> still walks free!
You guys have simply got to get a grip on both Laura Bush and Teddy Kennedy.
It’s all water under the bridge (pun intended) for pete sake! Get on with
something that matters, will ya?! Geesh!
Laura Bush murdered her boy friend wrote:
> Polish Prince (Szynka) wrote:
> > What is unbelievable, Ted Kennedy did not serve a
> > single day in a jail cell, for Vehicular Homicide.
> > It is all about affluence and mighty bucks.
> Well – the case against him was pretty weak. In contrast to that
> against laura bush where even the police report said the fatal crash
> was her fault.
Was alcohol involved in Laura Welch’s case?
Witnesses put Teddy drinking for the entire afternoon and evening prior
to his departure with Mary Jo. I wonder why he didn’t hang around and
wait for the police after he murdered Mary Jo?
On Mon, 24 Oct 2005 09:30:10 GMT, Polish Prince (Szynka)
<wawrzek…@worldnet.att.net> said the following in rec.autos.driving…
> What is absolutely Amazing! He continues to
> serve as a U.S. Senator.
What is absolutely disgusting is that he keeps getting elected time and
time again…
–
Paul.
Self appointed unofficial overseer
of kooks and trolls in rec.autos.driving
and eternal roamer of the dark side of
usenet #6.659 (gas price of the beast).
On Mon, 24 Oct 2005 20:38:46 GMT, mark <markjs1@*nospam*yahoo.com> said
the following in rec.autos.driving…
> You must be a bush coddeling lying rightwing nutjob. How many people
> has your buddy laura bush killed & maimed? At least 1 !!!! And she
> still walks free!
And do tell, exactly *what* executive or legislative authority does laura
bush hold? And Exactly *what* executive or legislative authority does ted
kennedy hold?
Call me crazy, but I have a problem with murderers who used political
connections to get away with their crimes having the slightest
involvement in making the laws that the rest of us have to obey.
If you elitist libs cant’t handle that, tango sierra!
–
Paul.
Self appointed unofficial overseer
of kooks and trolls in rec.autos.driving
and eternal roamer of the dark side of
usenet #6.659 (gas price of the beast).
Paul. wrote:
> On Mon, 24 Oct 2005 20:38:46 GMT, mark <markjs1@*nospam*yahoo.com> said
> the following in rec.autos.driving…
> > You must be a bush coddeling lying rightwing nutjob. How many people
> > has your buddy laura bush killed & maimed? At least 1 !!!! And she
> > still walks free!
> And do tell, exactly *what* executive or legislative authority does laura
> bush hold?
What the fork does that have to do with anything?? She KILLED a guy by
her reckless driving and not a damn thing has ever been done to her.
Stop the criminal coddling.
Laura Bush murdered her boy friend wrote:
> Polish Prince (Szynka) wrote:
> > What is unbelievable, Ted Kennedy did not serve a
> > single day in a jail cell, for Vehicular Homicide.
> > It is all about affluence and mighty bucks.
> Well – the case against him was pretty weak. In contrast to that
> against laura bush where even the police report said the fatal crash
> was her fault.
How was the case weak against Kennedy? He left the scene and left the
woman to die in the river. John Travolta was only there to save her in
the movie "Blow Out", not in real life.
–
"Throw me that lipstick, darling, I wanna redo my stigmata."
+-Jennifer Saunders, "Absolutely Fabulous"
Paul. wrote:
> On Mon, 24 Oct 2005 09:30:10 GMT, Polish Prince (Szynka)
> <wawrzek…@worldnet.att.net> said the following in rec.autos.driving…
>>What is absolutely Amazing! He continues to
>>serve as a U.S. Senator.
> What is absolutely disgusting is that he keeps getting elected time and
> time again…
People like him. The Republicans can’t even find a serious condidate to
run against him. The last time they ran Jack E. Robinson who has had a
few car crashes of his own, including one while he was doing a radio
interview on his cell phone.
–
John Mara
Laura Bush murdered her boy friend:
> Well – the case against him was pretty weak.
You blood guzzling ghoul! Only because that fat masshole hid the crime
for almost 1/2 a day – long enough for him to sober up and the water to
deal with the rest of the evidence.
Also helps that he had the cops in his back pocket to botch what was left
of the investigation and deny justice for Mary Jo. Its time for some
street justice to send fat ass (both kennedy and you) to hell where you
both belong.
On Wed, 26 Oct 2005 00:47:51 GMT, John Mara <johnm…@nycap.rr.com> said
the following in rec.autos.driving…
> People like him. The Republicans can’t even find a serious condidate to
> run against him. The last time they ran Jack E. Robinson who has had a
> few car crashes of his own, including one while he was doing a radio
> interview on his cell phone.
Politicians in MA seem to be rather accident prone…
Memo to self: stay out of MA.
On 24 Oct 2005 23:03:06 -0700, Laura Bush murdered her boy friend
<xeton2…@yahoo.com> said the following in rec.autos.driving…
> What the fork does that have to do with anything?? She KILLED a guy by
> her reckless driving and not a damn thing has ever been done to her.
You know damn well what it has to do with anything. Kennedy murdered his
misteress to keep secret things that would bring his political ambitions
down. Fortunately it has kept his fat ass out of the whitehouse.
And BTW, the word is "FUCK," not "fork." You sound like a fucking idiot
saying "fork."
> Stop the criminal coddling.
The same time that they stop coddling ted kennedy.
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
John Mara wrote:
> Paul. wrote:
> > On Mon, 24 Oct 2005 09:30:10 GMT, Polish Prince (Szynka)
> > <wawrzek…@worldnet.att.net> said the following in rec.autos.driving…
> >>What is absolutely Amazing! He continues to
> >>serve as a U.S. Senator.
> > What is absolutely disgusting is that he keeps getting elected time and
> > time again…
> People like him. The Republicans can’t even find a serious condidate to
> run against him. The last time they ran Jack E. Robinson who has had a
> few car crashes of his own, including one while he was doing a radio
> interview on his cell phone.
> —
> John Mara
I honestly didn’t believe you until I found
http://www.anecdotage.com/index.php?aid=969 .
"Hours after formally announcing his candidacy, Robinson found himself
in a three-car accident, which occurred while he was conducting a live
radio interview via cellphone. (Listeners were treated to the sounds of
squealing tires and slamming metal.) Topping things off, a witness
accused Robinson of trying to flee the scene of the accident – an
unfortunate leveller in a race against Kennedy…"
Classic case of the two parties proving how alike they really are.
Dave
On Wed, 26 Oct 2005 00:47:51 GMT, John Mara <johnm…@nycap.rr.com>
wrote:
>Paul. wrote:
>> On Mon, 24 Oct 2005 09:30:10 GMT, Polish Prince (Szynka)
>> <wawrzek…@worldnet.att.net> said the following in rec.autos.driving…
>>>What is absolutely Amazing! He continues to
>>>serve as a U.S. Senator.
>> What is absolutely disgusting is that he keeps getting elected time and
>> time again…
>People like him. The Republicans can’t even find a serious condidate to
It has nothing to do with that. The problem is that liberals from
messachoosets are too stupid to realize how much they are getting
screwed.